23 May 2022, PHRF-NB Meeting Minutes

PHRF-NBMeeting MinutesMay 2022

 

Date:          Monday, May 23, 2022

Location:   Zoom

 

I.        Call to Order: 6:30pm

 

II.        Roll Call:  Don Kern, Commodore; Will Museler, rating chairman; Roy Guay, Treasurer; Bob Horton, secretary; Ec Helme, committee member; Ken Madeiro, committee member, Vin McAteer, committee member; Mark Nannini, committee member; Randy Shore, committee member; Matt Smith, , committee member; Kathy Rotsky, PHRF-NB Administrator

 

III.        Approval Meeting Minutes: The minutes from the April 25, 2022 meeting were voted and seconded by the members present to be accepted as distributed unanimously.

 

IV.        Appeals: 

a)    2022 Certificate #16390 - Mutinous Dog, Tartan Ten, Marc Holdaway. Mr Holoway contends that the rating of his Tartan Ten should be identical to the Tartan Ten Lorax. The difference between the two ratings is that Lora has received a credit for using a headsail smaller than 155%. Extensive review of other PHRF area found that most T10's race with larger head sails and only the Great Lakes are had a T10 One Design fleet that rated the boats as 126. After a lengthy discussion it was agreed that Mutinous Dog should have received a credit to its rating for having a smaller headsail. Mr Holdaway entered the meeting and was informed that his rating would receive a credit of 9 sec for the smaller sail and that due to the action of the committee his appeal fee would be refunded.

b)    2022 Certificate 16326 - Hawksbill, Beneteau First 27SE, David Wilson, appealed his rating based on his assumption that the Beneteau 1st 27 is the same boat as a Seascape 27 that was produced since 2011.  The committee compared the newer Beneteau First 27SE to other PHRF areas various boats racing on Narragansett Bay ORC rates the Seascape differently than the First 27SE with the Seascape rated slower. After discussing the comparable boats it was agreed by the members present that a provisional base rating of 90 would be assigned for the 2022 season. Rating Chairman Will Museler will notify Mr. Wilson of the provisional base rating and our reasoning.

 

V.        Ratings:

a)       2022 Certificate #16763 - Marten 49, Pugilist, Dudley Johnson, owner. This is was formerly AKA Summer Storm. The rating of -45 was in effect previously. Members present agreed that the rating should remain at -45.

b)      2022 Certificate #16429 & 16885 - Sabre Spirit 36 WK, Erocia, Robert Green, owner. It was noted that as designed the boat comes with a below deck roller furler and a self-tacking jib. Regression formula reflects 109, Members present agreed that the provisional rating should be 117

c)       2022 Certificate #16745 - Botin 55, Outlier, Harvey Jones, owner, email attached to the minutes. Members present agreed that this should be presented by the owner as an appeal of the rating.

d)      2022 Certificate #16747 - 12 Meter, Columbia US16, Kevin Hegarty, owner. Agreed by the members present that we would follow the precedent set by the 12 Meter Association that has PHRF ratings of Traditional -33, Classic -30, Modern, and Grand Prix

e)       2022 Certificate #16708 - International 110, Pelican, Steve Clark, questioned the base rating. The members present agreed that this model with 1 trapeze and a 180% headsail should be rated at a base of 174.

 

VI.        Ratings Review:

a)       2022 Certificate #16335 - Freedom 30 SD, Serendipity, Gary Venable owner. Email attached at the bottom of the minutes. Members present agreed to leave the 2022 base rating as is at 202.

 

VII.        Old Business:

a)    Communication with US Sailing and proposed agenda to US Sailing. – No update.

b)    12 Meter update – this was addressed in the open ratings section

c)    Changes and updates to PHRF-NB website.

i)           Roy’s talk to Erik about feasibility and cost

ii)         Others contact with potential webmasters

VIII.        New Business:

a)      Meeting June 27th - Zoom

a)         Boats that carry no spinnaker, should they be receiving a spinnaker rating.  It was agreed by the members present that the standard measurements would be plugged in if no measurements are supplied even if the owner states no spinnaker on board.

 

IX.        Adjournment:


From Gary Venabal dated 5/10

I was hoping to have this resolved before the first race…. Which is tonight (JYC)…I have forwarded my PHRF (to JYC) showing a rating of 199….. Last night I reviewed the PHRF notes of February which indicated the committee was looking into the ratings for the various NONSUCH’s…. there was no mention of the Freedoms.   After further investigation I have the following observations:

-           Over the last several years there have been only 8 Freedoms that had a PHRF rating ….. 4 of them had it for one year… one for 2 years (Hoyt designed 32)  Pedrick and Koch have raced their Freedom 35’s for more years than I raced my 30…. And now Koch has decided to race another boat this year…. Which leaves only Dave Pedrick and myself racing Freedoms.

-          Dave Pedrick has raced the boat that he designed ….The Pedrick Freedom 35 was offered with traditional Freedom Club Foot jib (like my Gary Mull designed 30SD) or roller furling which is what he has.

-          Of the three Mull designed Freedoms that are listed in the rating history …. Claus has 30 with standard keel and was rated 205 …he raced one year 2017

Collins has Freedom 32 (same boat as Claus but with a swim platform) his rating in 2019 was 206…. And Caspersen who registered a 32SD and received a 207 rating 2018…. None of these boats raced again.

-          There is only one NONSUCH  registered this year “Encore” which has a base rating of 240 and a non-spin rating of 248.  

-          STAR DANCER….Dave Pedrick’s boat has a spin rating of 132 and a non-spin rating of 142….

-          There are 165 registered boats in PHRF-NB (some twice ..J-109s r) all but two boats have a spin credit …. SERENDIPITY and a Marshall Sanderling (Catboat)..which carries a rating of 321.

Given all the above I fail to understand why our rating was dinged for 12 secs a mile.

I appreciate all that you do and fully understand how difficult it must be to “get it right”.   We have been somewhat successful but I believe that  is because we have learned the boat over the years, it is well prepped, I have two crew members that have extensive sailing and racing experience.  

I had thought that once the facts were presented …. That Serendipity is in fact a sloop, capable of carrying a spinnaker and not a NONSUCH, this would be easily corrected.

Please let me know if I need to file an appeal…. But nothing has changed on the boat for the last seven years so I hope I needn’t

 

From Harvey Jones/Botin 55, Outlier

 

 Kathy,

I just submitted the renewal for OUTLIER’s PHRF-NB certificate in preparation for the NYYC Annual Regatta in June. I didn’t see a place to add notes to the renewal application so I am submitting this email for that purpose.

OUTLIER’s original PHRF-NB certificate was issued in 2019, the year the boat was built, prior to any racing and with little information about her performance. The PHRF-NB Committee did the best job they could, given what they had to work with, rating the boat. Now we have 3 years of experience racing under CRF and PHRF-NE and OUTLIER’s performance can be compared to other boats. I hope the Committee will take a new look.

After the first season, PHRF-NE modified OUTLIER’s rating from -48/-39 to -39/-30. Further a good boat to compare to OUTLIER is Irie-2. They share many of the same dimensions with the major difference being weight. Irie-2 is a carbon boat with no interior to speak of, while OUTLIER is a wooden boat with a full wood interior. OUTLIER weighs twice as much as Irie-2. I realize PHRF-NE and PHRF-NB are different but boat-to-boat comparisons are legitimate. In PHRF-NE Irie-2 is rated -69/-60 thus there is a 30 second/mile difference to OUTLIER’s -39/-30 PHRF-NE rating. Given the 9 second adjustment PHRF-NE made to OUTLIER’s rating from -48/-39 to -39/-30 and the 30 second PHRF-NE spread between Irie-2 and OUTLIER, I would respectfully request the PHRF-NB consider a similar adjustment to OUTLIER’s 2022 PHRF-NB rating.

I would appreciate it if you would share this email with whoever is involved in formulating the rating.

Thank you,

Harvey Jones

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